Friday, February 22, 2008
Muslims
Dad wanted me to share this article that he came across with everyone. Read, ingest, comment, etc. We've had discussions in the past about Dad's view of Islam and those who claim to be Muslim and what he thinks of them, so I'm sure he's curious to hear what you all have to say after reading Mr. Orson Scott Card's essay.
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12 comments:
I'm small-minded. I don't care to ready anything by Orson Scott Card for personal reasons. I'd read it from someone else, but not him.
Mom
Mom was offended by his writing about love and things among church people (real people, but fictional accounts). She may be right in her feelings, but this should be read on its merits, even as she says she has before.
Dad Clark
This was a fairly good article and I agree with many of the points he made. However, there really is a big difference between Western Muslims and Muslims from the Middle East and some parts of Africa. The more educated a person is, the more tolerant they tend to be. The Muslims I know are very kind, generous people. One of my Muslim friends has recently left Islam and has not been killed yet nor is he worried. He also just spent an extended period of time in the Middle East and is still alive. I think that generally Sharia law has more of an effect in poorer, less educated areas. We really can't paint all Muslims with the same brush. Card does make some good arguements about freedom. It should be remembered that there was no real freedom in Christianity for 1500 years either. Maybe by the time Islam has been around for 1500 years, its adherants will experience greater freedom. However, we should never be a party to reducing individual freedoms by supporting governments that do.
Dad doesn't have to make any excuses for me -- I would never base any opinion by one I considered less that reliable to be influential on my opinions.
But, hopefully, none of you thought I was indicating that if you read Orson Scott Card's writings that you are small-minded. I was only talking about my inability to get past some experiences with one of his books and some dealings the Teichert family had with his fabrications to make the story better. I would never consider him a reliable source for anything but that doesn't mean any of you need to feel that way at all. I'm sure there's some value in what he writes that's not science fiction.
Mom
I don't really have much to say. It was an interesting read, but like Jason, I don't really want to paint Muslims with a wide brush. And neither did Mr. Card -- he was referring to fanatical Muslims. Unlike Jason, however, the only Muslims I've met were students at BYU that I briefly worked with but didn't really forge any relationships with.
I did want to comment on this from the essay, though: "In other words, they support the freedom of non-Muslims to convert to Islam -- but not the freedom of Muslims to choose to leave Islam."
I've felt that way in the LDS church! Not to the extreme, of course. But we proselyte like the best of them, expect people to leave their family religions/traditions to join with this cause we believe in, but then we shake our heads and pass judgment on those on the other side. I've recently run across this situation. We want the person who left the church to know that we disapprove of their decision, but we also want them to know that we love them and still value their friendship, but it's hard. How have you guys interacted with someone close to you who has left the church? -Jester
I have a friend, a roommate that I was/am close to, leave the church. It was really hard for me to see her start down that path. She definitely felt snubbed by people in the church. She knows that I am disappointed in her choices but we continue to be good friends and I don't talk to her about her choices or feelings about the church. I think if she knows that I still love her and care about her as my friend, she will trust me and if she ever needed something from me she would know I would be there for her. I recently saw pictures of her on her personal website and was so sad to see what she was doing in those pictures. But I still love her and hope someday she will find her way back. I also hope that someday she will see how happy I am being a part of the church and that she will want to have that same happiness.
I don't like generalizations and stereotypes. Not all Muslims are horrible people, not all Christians are great people. There is good in everyone. Obviously, everyone that is born on this earth was on the right path at some point! I think if the world would spend more time looking for the good in people (including those radical muslims looking for good in Americans) then maybe we wouldn't have such a big problem. There are radicals as well as great people in every group.
By this article, I wonder that Obama would dare even visit a Muslim country if he were president, since he was once muslim and has openly touted his christianity, especially if he were president of "Great Satan" on top of that. If I were a devout muslim, I would want to behead him and play soccer with that head.
Sometimes we have to take the blinders of political correctness off and call barbarism for what it is, even if it goes by the name of Islam.
Those Sci-fi writers can be quirky, look at L.Ron Hubbard, founder of Scientology.
Hans, I think my dad would kiss you right now if you were within reach. Thanks for making his day.
Hey, how did you know it was Hans who wrote that comment? I guess I'm just not that clever. I thought it was funny and you're right jess, dad would kiss him. I think Iraq has definately given Hans that up close and personal opinion of things over there. Interesting...
Lindsey
Well, I do see the problem the Ender's Game author writes about however I dont think our efforts in the middle east thus far have made any progress against it. After all we came over here for "weapons of mass destruction" and any attempts at changing the islamic culture would make us out to be what the terrorists claim we are which is "crusaders". The army's intentions here are still politically correct and dare not address the elephant in the room.
But like author says, the problem of this singular minded thinking,( which as Jess correctly points out we also share accept we just brow beat people, not actually kill them) will lead to an inevitable clash sooner or later in history. And it must be confronted not just in middle east but everywhere there is Islam which is the states and especially europe where muslims reproduce much faster than europeans.
Hans
I really liked Ender's game.
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